Boatnerd Discussion Forum

RE: PDBLK25,

I don't think your points are at all well developed. Granted any discussion forum is to voice your opinions and you certainly seem to be resentful of divers' accessibility to the waters. As for visiting these ships where people have died I have a good on-land parallel. I've visited Fort Sumter, SC, Gettysburg, PA, and even Normandy, France. What better way to remember those who perished than by paying respects up close and personal. Divers are typically well aware of tragedies that have occurred and don't take it lightly. I just dove the Comet, a Kingston, Ontario wreck where two people died. It's solemn of exploring Lake Ontario - knowing that at any time nature can turn against you. Diving has given me a better appreciation for natural beauty, natural ferocity, and a better understanding that life can end before you're ready. Yes, the dives are interesting and I'd be lying if I didn't find the wrecks fascinating. It's fair to say that I know more about those who died in those wrecks than you and it's because of diving - it puts you in closer contact with history.

Here's a dive related joke from a photography forum I belong to.

- Don


Finally - - An answer I can understand!






An American tourist asks a Newfoundlander:
"Why do Scuba divers always fall
backwards off their boats?"






To which the Newfoundlander replies:
"If they fell forwards they'd still be in the fu--ing boat!"

Wolfe Islander II and I were born about the same time and I spent my life riding her in the summer, only steered her once. I can still hear the steering engine in my mind as we used to sit on the cover. I was on her a couple times in the winter when the Salvage Monarch used to pull her through the ice, see the pic link below. The tug jerked her pretty good starting up, pretty cool. Lots of great memories. I was disappointed that they were going to sink her. The day they sunk her was a good chance to say good-bye but at least she's still around. Good years and good times for sure.
Mr Brother and I have some assorted pics of Wolfe islander II and 3, and the Horne's boat William Darrell at:
www.flickr.com/photos/wcwolfe

All ships are built with the knowledge that once their use full life is over they are scrapped. Its awesome that a few can be come dive sites and artificial reefs. This is not only good for the diving folks, but even better for the oceans or lakes that they become part of. As they slowly rust away they become beautiful habitats for under water life. What's a more fitting end for proud vessel that served their owners well.

Some underwater footage I shoot 15 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r82uxkc ... freload=10

enjoy

We divers have also contributed to finding wrecks and discovering designs and ways of lives that has not been written down in books and largely forgotten. There are thousands of divers here in the lakes that contribute to local economies and do because they love wrecks. I have been obsessed with the lakes since I was 2 years old and go out every spring to hunt for wrecks for the thrill of discovering lost history.

The Wolf Islander has nothing on it to begin with. She was stripped of most of her artifacts before scuttling. The divers paid for the ship to be scuttled off of Kingston and it attracts hundreds per year when all her future had in store was to be scrapped. At least the vessel exists as she sailed 80ft below the waves instead of in a pack of razor blades.

I have an ingot of the Pewabic and all it does is sit there. I inherited it by another old time diver who busted his rear bringing up a 30 lb piece of metal. I dove down to 190ft to pull up a steel billet off the EB Hale to see if the ship was worth salvaging (it was not), and doing all this runs in getting into a legal battle with the state over a rusted piece of junk. I have dove the Cedarville and the Lady Elgin and there is nothing on them. The Lady Elgin is broken up bad and represents a bunch of boards on the bottom. If someone gets killed in a car crash and car sits inn the junkyard for 20 years is it a gravesite?

I started this thread prepared for & dreading the answer I received. Dive Site, Dive Site - I'm so sick of those words. How many Boatnerds, or just folks who like ships Dive? 5%, 20% - I bet it's a lot less than 5%. So we sink ships (and accept the cost of making them clean & safe) for a small group of people. Then there are the underwater preserves: Thunder Bay (Alpena), Green Bay, etc. Hundreds of shipwrecks that only Divers see & touch and that will eventually rot into nothingness. I'd rather they let people take "Souvenirs". At least part of the wreck is preserved, and people who Cannot Dive have a chance of seeing artifacts from sunken ships. I'm not talking ghouls that uncaringly violate gravesites without regard for human remains. But what about someone who is willing to take the risk to recover copper from the Pewabic wreck, or someone who wants to salvage a useless or still useful wreck & let others see it (avoiding fiascos like the Alvin C. Clark). Also, divers are not always overly considerate. They explore the Milwaukee, Lady Elgin & Cedarville wrecks -- these are gravesites, not amusement parks. You want to dive? Fine, but non-divers shouldn't pay the way, or be denied the right to see at least part of the wreck.

The Wolfe Islander II is now a dive site near Kingston. She had outlived her usefulness and was used as the dive site instead of scrap. She is used as a safe site for training. At one time she was to be at the Marine Museum but they got the Alexander Henry instead. The Wolfe Islander I was a wooden steam paddle wheel ship and she was really in bad shape when she was retired in 1945. The Upper Canada used to work with the Wolfe Islander II and she is still tied up on the American side and has not run for many years. Both ships were too small for the traffic on the run to the island.

Today's "News Channel" was full of news about the ferry Wolfe Island III. That raises two questions for me. Where is (was) the Wolfe Island II? What was the Collingwood-Built in 1945, 144.25'x43'x8' MV. Wolfe Islander? Was she 1 or 2?

Why and where was she scuttled on September 21. 1985? It would seem that many individuals or Municipalities could have made use of a ship like this one.