Boatnerd Discussion Forum

I can remember a few years ago at about this time as the season was coming to a close. The tug Victory with then the James L. Kuber made a very rare trip with a grain shipment to Burns Harbor, Indiana. Sorry as I don’t recall what year it was made in? However, it was a one time only deal as they haven’t done anything like that since then.

Guest wrote:I have noticed a couple of recent grain shipments going from Duluth to Toledo. I believe H Lee White is doing this currently and Victory/Maumee took one last week. I haven’t noticed much domestic grain leaving Duluth other than the Buffalo bound grain for General Mills. Is Toledo a new destination or have I been been missing it before prior to these two loads. Also, if it is new any idea what caused it to start so late in the season?

Thanks

I can say with a decent amount of certainty that during the past twenty two or twenty three years (at least), the only grain shipments leaving Duluth-Superior aboard U.S.-flagged vessels for domestic transport (i.e. headed to another U.S. port) have gone to Buffalo, NY. The recent Toledo-bound shipments are at the very least a clear departure from the norm of the last two decades. It will be interesting to see if they continue next season and if this movement ends up being a brief/one-time thing or the development of something that is more like a new trade out of Duluth-Superior.

That's a roger Captain. They're bringing a winter storage load.

wlbblw wrote:I'm not sure what the combined length of Victory-Maumee is, so I'm not sure how much of a length record they will be until I find out BUT-

They will be the 1st ever tug-barge combo to unload at the Frontier Elevator, they'l be the 1st winter storage/lay up boats for Buffalo since the Frantz way back in 2003, it's the 1st time this unit has ever been to Buffalo, & it's the first time a converted laker tug-barge has been laid up here since the Wiltranco back in the later 60s/early 70s. I'm sure Reserve was here back in the old days but I've never seen her here in my 30 years of 'nerdin' in this town.

Victory/Maumee LOA when combined is 815'02''

Are they spending the winter in Buffalo then?

Denny wrote:Just a small bit rare for them to be headed to Toledo I’d say with them but, unless I missed something I thought I saw where the Victory and Maumee were headed to Buffalo with their load? As far as Toledo being a new destination? I would say No because they gotten Grain loads from other ports such as from Thunder Bay, Sarnia and Port Colborne among the other ports. Ships from Lower Lakes would load Grain cargoes from any of those ports then deliver it to Toledo. Hope this info has helped.

Clarke loaded oats at General Mills "A" in Duluth and I believe she finished at Cargill B-1 in Dec. of 1983 for Toledo.

I'm not sure what the combined length of Victory-Maumee is, so I'm not sure how much of a length record they will be until I find out BUT-

They will be the 1st ever tug-barge combo to unload at the Frontier Elevator, they'l be the 1st winter storage/lay up boats for Buffalo since the Frantz way back in 2003, it's the 1st time this unit has ever been to Buffalo, & it's the first time a converted laker tug-barge has been laid up here since the Wiltranco back in the later 60s/early 70s. I'm sure Reserve was here back in the old days but I've never seen her here in my 30 years of 'nerdin' in this town.

Longest ships in the Buffalo River:

Buffalo River to City Ship Canal GM: American Mariner: 730-feet

Buffalo River to City Ship Canal sand wharf: Herbert C Jackson: 690-feet

Buffalo River to ADM Standard Elevator: Elton Hoyt II: 698-feet*

*At 27,550 tons, Manitoulin is the largest capacity ship by tonnage to go up as far as ADM, & at 78' beam, shes' also the widest, but at 660', not the longest*

Buffalo River to Lake & Rail Elevator: American Fortitude: 690-feet

Buffalo River Republic Steel docks: Buffalo, Sam Laud, American Republic: 634'

Buffalo River Mobil Oil docks: Gemini: 435'

Longest tug-barge units on the Buffalo River:

Buffalo River to City Ship Canal Sand Supply Wharf: Defiance - Ashtabula: ~ 700' combined

Buffalo River ADM Standard Elevator: Jane Ann 4th - Sarah Spencer: 729' combined

Mobil Oil Dock: Stephen Reinauer - George Morris: ~ 400' combined

Longest ships in Lackawanna Canal:

Bethlehem Steel: Stewart J Cort, Indiana Harbor, both 1,000'

Longest tug-barge unit, Lackawanna:

Gateway Metroport Main Dock (old Bethlehem ore dock): Presque Isle 1,000' combined

Longest ships in Black Rock Canal/Niagara River:

Maritime Class ships Richard Reiss, George A Sloan: 620'- (max allowable size for B.R. Lock)

Longest tug-barge: Francis A Small - Wiltranco: ~ 600'

No problem Guest and glad to help out whenever I can. To add though to my comments below. With the tug Victory and barge Maumee headed to Buffalo I got to thinking and wondering "What is the longest vessel to navigate the Buffalo River and unload grain there?" With the tug Victory in the notch of the barge Maumee if you will, would then their overall length be a new record for the longest vessel to unload grain then in Buffalo? Not sure what their overall length together would be but I got to believe IMO anyway this could be a record? Anyone from Buffalo such as Brian might be able to fill us in as he's the expert on Buffalo activity!

Thanks Denny. Victory/Maumee is currently headed to Buffalo however, they did a Duluth to Toledo trip last week. I found it odd to see two domestic grain loads leaving Duluth in a week that weren’t Buffalo bound! Maybe it is a sign of things to come with ASC/Rand/Lower Lakes coming together.

Thanks Again

Just a small bit rare for them to be headed to Toledo I’d say with them but, unless I missed something I thought I saw where the Victory and Maumee were headed to Buffalo with their load? As far as Toledo being a new destination? I would say No because they gotten Grain loads from other ports such as from Thunder Bay, Sarnia and Port Colborne among the other ports. Ships from Lower Lakes would load Grain cargoes from any of those ports then deliver it to Toledo. Hope this info has helped.

I have noticed a couple of recent grain shipments going from Duluth to Toledo. I believe H Lee White is doing this currently and Victory/Maumee took one last week. I haven’t noticed much domestic grain leaving Duluth other than the Buffalo bound grain for General Mills. Is Toledo a new destination or have I been been missing it before prior to these two loads. Also, if it is new any idea what caused it to start so late in the season?

Thanks