Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

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Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Jon Paul » January 29, 2021, 9:59 pm

Guest wrote:
FWE wrote:I believe it was the PATTON that had the triple chime steam whistle fitted to her stack, would be interested in that story .
Didn't that chime come off another ship? For some reason I keep thing the J. E. Upson but I'm probably wrong.
The chime whistle was originally on the J E Upson and Chief John Abbott brought it over to the Patton. He told me the story himself while Chief on the White in '76

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 29, 2021, 7:17 pm

FWE wrote:I believe it was the PATTON that had the triple chime steam whistle fitted to her stack, would be interested in that story .
Didn't that chime come off another ship? For some reason I keep thing the J. E. Upson but I'm probably wrong.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by pcolachap » January 29, 2021, 3:09 pm

On the topic of C4's and speed in the South East Channel, the captain of the Joseph H. Thompson at least once received a copy of a bill Hanna had paid to a Harsens Island resident for flooded septic tanks. Dad's remark was they needed to have their canals flushed out once in a while. Another item, the large stern. While attempting to fuel at the Shell dock in Corona, Ontario, we were not able to get to the fueling station because of a barge at the lower dock. The Captain was not pleased especially since we had already landed at Shell. But, never fear, the Imperial dock was open. The voyage continued.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 29, 2021, 12:42 pm

Back in the 1970s did the crews tend to stick together from year to year or was there a constant change up due to seniority, union, company rules, etc.?

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by FWE » January 29, 2021, 12:37 pm

I believe it was the PATTON that had the triple chime steam whistle fitted to her stack, would be interested in that story .

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by FWE » January 29, 2021, 12:32 pm

I believe it was the PATTON that had the triple chime steam whistle fitted to her stack, would be interested in that story .

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Jon Paul » January 29, 2021, 10:53 am

The fellow in the orange hat manning the steam winch in the last photo I posted was AB watchman Louis Ploof. He had sailed for decades with Republic, Wilson then Cliffs and took the time to mentor a brash 20 yr old deckhand. He knew I was interested in working my way up the hawse pipe and took the time to teach me the finer points of being an Able Seaman that books couldn't teach.
Yes the C-4's did occassionally go to Cleveland while in Cliffs color. We would usually stop at Lorain or Cleveland to unload down to river draft on the Cuyahoga and then proceed up river to the Republic docks.
In fact during one of those Cleveland runs in Dec '77 I went uptown and wrote for and passed my AB test. Upon returning to the White I found out one of the watchman had jumped ship and stepped right into the job.
The photo was taken in Feb '78

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 29, 2021, 9:41 am

Guest wrote:“Those forward deckhouses were pretty unique. I only saw one of these ships in the fall of 1979 when I first moved to St. Clair Michigan at the age of eleven. But even after forty years, I can still see the Cleveland-Cliffs house flag flying from the forward mast in the bright afternoon sunshine as I was on my way home from school.” End quote.

Wow, back in the early 60’s ( 8 or 9 years old) I watched those huge vessels round SE bend on the Ste Claire River from a neighbor’s cottage. Little did I know then that in a few years, I would be working on those ships passing by my old neighbor’s cottage.

While growing up in Algonac during the early 1980s I had a paper route that took me onto most of the canal homes on the north end of the city. I remember that one house on Chestnut Street someone had a handpainted mural on their garage door of a Republic Steel C4 steamer. It was done very nicely so either the person living there was extremely talented or they hired an artist to do the work. At the time area residents still recalled the wakes of these ships often flooding out their shoreline yards during an era in which river speeds were not as strictly enforced as they are today. Given that perspective, I always thought it a bit strange that someone would paint such a ship on their garage door in a low lying canal area. Perhaps someone who had sailed lived there? Unfortunately, the house was not on my route so I never did learn the name of the residents that lived there.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 29, 2021, 7:21 am

“Those forward deckhouses were pretty unique. I only saw one of these ships in the fall of 1979 when I first moved to St. Clair Michigan at the age of eleven. But even after forty years, I can still see the Cleveland-Cliffs house flag flying from the forward mast in the bright afternoon sunshine as I was on my way home from school.” End quote.

Wow, back in the early 60’s ( 8 or 9 years old) I watched those huge vessels round SE bend on the Ste Claire River from a neighbor’s cottage. Little did I know then that in a few years, I would be working on those ships passing by my old neighbor’s cottage.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 29, 2021, 7:09 am

“Those C4 conversions must have really been something to sail on. Did the extra long fantail create any problems for them on the lakes? Weren't these regular callers to Cleveland? If so, did they go up the Cuyahoga or did they unload at the Lakefront dock? “ end quote.

As an old retired mate now, I can tell you they were a blast to sail on. When out on the open lake we usually spent the whole watch figuring out when and where we would over take the vessels ahead of us. The long fantail didn’t cause any problems. It was a great place to have water fights between crew members. Famous water fight was Rod vs Fran. Yes, we went up the Cuyahoga River to unload at Republic Steel docks. One year on the White, we hauled a month to McClouth Steel, (Trenton Mi.) then a month to S. Chicago. Then we would repeat it most of the season.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 28, 2021, 8:45 pm

Those C4 conversions must have really been something to sail on. Did the extra long fantail create any problems for them on the lakes? Weren't these regular callers to Cleveland? If so, did they go up the Cuyahoga or did they unload at the Lakefront dock?

Those forward deckhouses were pretty unique. I only saw one of these ships in the fall of 1979 when I first moved to St. Clair Michigan at the age of eleven. But even after forty years, I can still see the Cleveland-Cliffs house flag flying from the forward mast in the bright afternoon sunshine as I was on my way home from school. Hard to believe that in less than a year later, these three would be on the way to the scrapyard.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Jon Paul » January 28, 2021, 3:34 pm

Guest wrote:Old mate from the C-4’s here, (when Cliffs had them) Box in question is a fire station. Jon Paul can best answer this for sure.
After looking at photo's I took I can confirm it is a fire station. I have attached some photos that show it on the lower left side of the photo facing aft.
If my old shipmate who responded earlier is who I think it is (KL) he is the one who gave my my first times on the wheel in the lake making hauls during his 8-12 watch when I was a deckhand.
Attachments
Close up shot showing firebox lower left
Close up shot showing firebox lower left
fantaila.jpg
cmwhite2.jpg

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 27, 2021, 6:29 pm

Old mate from the C-4’s here, (when Cliffs had them) Box in question is a fire station. Jon Paul can best answer this for sure.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 27, 2021, 5:04 pm

Looking more closely at this, it does appear to be a firefighting station. One can see the outline of what looks to be a red fire main on the right and a hanger for a coiled hose in the center. Harder to see in Patton photo because the interior of the box is painted red.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 27, 2021, 2:12 pm

Here is a snippet of a Hiawatha post card image slide showing the Girdler in Republic colors, as she was entering the MacArthur Lock, downbound. So, that cabinet was there prior to the Cliffs livery. Maybe this will help jog Jon Paul's memory.
Attachments
Girdler fantail
Girdler fantail
img041.jpg (52.38 KiB) Viewed 7325 times

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 27, 2021, 12:41 pm

shirtofgreen wrote:
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:Perhaps it's one of those "boxes" that a a firehose is stored in-just with the cover/door and hose removed?

You could very well be right! I wonder what that hatch is for just in front of the fixture in question?

looking at older pictures, it was there from at least 77. The emergency steering setup is there to the starboard, did these older ships have sound-powered headsets?

The hatch forward of that assembly looks to be a good spot to remove and install heavy steering assemblies. Thats my guess.
Was the harch for a sompartment from the ship's original construction? Was there a small cargo hold in that location originally?

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by shirtofgreen » January 27, 2021, 11:50 am

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:Perhaps it's one of those "boxes" that a a firehose is stored in-just with the cover/door and hose removed?

You could very well be right! I wonder what that hatch is for just in front of the fixture in question?

looking at older pictures, it was there from at least 77. The emergency steering setup is there to the starboard, did these older ships have sound-powered headsets?

The hatch forward of that assembly looks to be a good spot to remove and install heavy steering assemblies. Thats my guess.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 27, 2021, 10:00 am

Jon Paul is your guy for answering questions on the Republic C4s. He’s posted elsewhere that beneath the hatch is a hold that is a carryover from the saltwater design. It was used on the Lakes as a machine shop and engineering stores space, complete with lathes, etc.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Jon Paul » January 27, 2021, 9:59 am

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:Perhaps it's one of those "boxes" that a a firehose is stored in-just with the cover/door and hose removed?

You could very well be right! I wonder what that hatch is for just in front of the fixture in question?
If you are referencing the large hatch just aft of the after cabins, that is a leftover from the C-4 days.
To my recollection I don't remember the White having the red box in question.
An interesting note is that along both sides of the anchor chain leading from the windless are the spare buckets for the propeller the the Triplets carried.

Re: Red Fixture on Stern of Thomas F. Patton

by Guest » January 26, 2021, 12:18 pm

Guest wrote:Perhaps it's one of those "boxes" that a a firehose is stored in-just with the cover/door and hose removed?

You could very well be right! I wonder what that hatch is for just in front of the fixture in question?

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