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i believe it is still canadian flag and crewed, she has a stop over in st, johns, nfld. time will tell we will have to wait and see!

I remember when environmentalists were calling Paul Martin a Coal Baron, all because CSL self-unloaders were delivering coal to the coal-fired powerplant in Nanticoke - despite the fact that neither he/his family or Canada Steamship Lines owned any coal mines.

Is the Algosea/Kathy McKeil still Canadian flag and crewed? Will it be reflagged/recrewed at some point before leaving Canadian waters?

Thanks Alan for the interesting information.

And here I was so sure that you were the one mixed up. I'd of bet money that you were thinking that this was the one that was rebuilt into the Rt. Hon. Paul J. Martin (with a clear political connection to the son that became Canada's prime minister) rather than the seemingly benign name that she actually received, Assiniboine.

[quote]I still don't follow you.[/quote]

As I mentioned in my initial post... “long story short”. There are countless articles online that cover Paul E.P. Martin’s time in government (as Finance Minister and Prime Minister) and his ownership of CSL. During this time, he faced tremendous scrutiny from the media, lobby groups and the Official Opposition.

He faced questions about CSL International’s use of Flags of Convenience, government grants and contracts (originally stated as $137,000 but later found to be $79 million) and CSL International’s use of tax shelters. There were even questions of how and where their ships were scrapped (* notice how we no longer say “scrap” but now use the term “recycle”). Even after he sold CSL to his three sons, there were allegations of interdependence.

The rebuild of the Jean Parisien was the first vessel to be rebuilt while Mr. Martin was Prime Minister. There are all kinds of ridiculous scenarios that politicians and lobbyists can make up and CSL wanted to distance themselves from [u]all[/u] politics (perceived or real) and took a few extra steps to distance themselves from any scrutiny.

When the announcement was made, it was a simple press release posted on their website and distributed to a handful of trade papers and insiders. It was picked up by local, regional and national news outlets, but it wasn't a large celebratory announcement as you might imagine. CSL also made it clear the rebuild was “self financed”.

A decision was also made to not just paint out the name, but all markings on the Jean Parisien. The stack, the billboards, the port of registry; everything was painted out. For the uninitiated, there was no way of knowing which vessel it was or who the owner was. This was done to keep the boat anonymous before the announcement and when the former hull section went to scrap.

I understand that it is easy to debate that decision and its necessity and effectiveness nearly 20 years after the fact. But that was the decision made at the time.

To this day, Mr. Martin continues to face allegations and forced to defend his role with CSL years after exiting politics. In 2017, he was named in the Paradise Papers facing allegations from when he no longer owned the company. Go figure!

[quote="Alan Francis" post_id=258511 time=1701390543]
[quote=Guest post_id=258482 time=1701307102]
The Jean Parisien was named posthumously in honor of the man who was the Senior Deputy Chairman of Power Corp. of Canada at the time plans were made to build this vessel. There wasn't a need to cover her markings a few weeks in advance of a rebuilding announcement decades after his death to avoid accusations of political favoritism.
[/quote]

It had nothing to do with Jean Parisien. It had everything to do with Paul E.P. Martin who was Prime Minister at the time.
[/quote]

I still don't follow you. They had to black out the name Jean Parisien a few weeks before her rebuilding was announced in 2004 to avoid issues of political favoritism with the then current Paul Martin administration on a ship that was renamed after a river when rechristened the following March?

Are you sure you're not thinking of the H.M. Griffith? She's the one that was rechristened the Rt. Hon. Paul J. Martin at the start of the 2000 season when she re-entered service after being rebuilt with a new forebody, a few years before Paul Martin became Canada's prime minister.

[quote="Alan Francis" post_id=258511 time=1701390543]
[quote=Guest post_id=258482 time=1701307102]
The Jean Parisien was named posthumously in honor of the man who was the Senior Deputy Chairman of Power Corp. of Canada at the time plans were made to build this vessel. There wasn't a need to cover her markings a few weeks in advance of a rebuilding announcement decades after his death to avoid accusations of political favoritism.
[/quote]

It had nothing to do with Jean Parisien. It had everything to do with Paul E.P. Martin who was Prime Minister at the time.
[/quote]

Named after the Deputy Chairman of CSL's parent firm, who died suddenly in his office the previous year.

[attachment=0]Screenshot 2023-12-01 10.01.04.png[/attachment]

[quote=Guest post_id=258482 time=1701307102]
The Jean Parisien was named posthumously in honor of the man who was the Senior Deputy Chairman of Power Corp. of Canada at the time plans were made to build this vessel. There wasn't a need to cover her markings a few weeks in advance of a rebuilding announcement decades after his death to avoid accusations of political favoritism.
[/quote]

It had nothing to do with Jean Parisien. It had everything to do with Paul E.P. Martin who was Prime Minister at the time.

The Jean Parisien was named posthumously in honor of the man who was the Senior Deputy Chairman of Power Corp. of Canada at the time plans were made to build this vessel. There wasn't a need to cover her markings a few weeks in advance of a rebuilding announcement decades after his death to avoid accusations of political favoritism.

[quote=Guest post_id=258176 time=1700328803]
I don't know about the registration, but some others that were rebuilt have had their names and stacks similarly painted out.

The Jean Parisien for instance painted out the billboard lettering on her hull (with a black stack and her names painted out) at Port Weller a month before the announcement came that she'd be rebuilt there. They didn't just paint out her markings on the forebody that was to be removed and scrapped at IMS, but covered everything on the stern as well, which was to be refurbished right there and mated to her new forebody.
[/quote]

Long story short - Paul E.P. Martin was Prime Minister during this time and CSL wanted to distance themselves from the PMO to avoid any accusations of political favouritism (subsidies, opportunism, rhetoric, etc.) for the rebuild.

[quote=Guest post_id=258227 time=1700487953]
I believe she will not be a self-unloader by what we know with tunnels and conveyor belts but will be fitted with cranes.
[/quote]

You may be right about that. I can't see Algoma selling a vessel to another shipping company for conversion into a conventional self-unloader by Great Lakes standards that could compete head to head with their own self-unloaders.

I believe she will not be a self-unloader by what we know with tunnels and conveyor belts but will be fitted with cranes.

syd the stern was a clarke steamship vessel, chimo or cabot im not sure. some times clarke use to charter crobie vessels. crosby with a Y is the molasses company from saint john, n.b. to add to the confusion crosbie called their shipping line "chimo lines" they went bankrupt around 1982

Just because she’s a tanker doesn’t mean she can’t become a self unloaders They could be building a new fore body I think it was the Canadian Transfer that was two or three ships put together The stern was a Crosby lines ship ? Hull an old laker If that’s correct

this isnt the first tanker algoma central has sold to mckeil. they sold the capt. ralph tucker to them in the late 90s

I think the scrapping telltale is when they make a new name out of the retired name for the tow.

TC registration is not closed, she is renamed KATHY MCKEIL.

As of Saturday night the name Kathy McKeil is on the bow of the former Algosea and the stack has been painted white.

I don't know about the registration, but some others that were rebuilt have had their names and stacks similarly painted out.

The Jean Parisien for instance painted out the billboard lettering on her hull (with a black stack and her names painted out) at Port Weller a month before the announcement came that she'd be rebuilt there. They didn't just paint out her markings on the forebody that was to be removed and scrapped at IMS, but covered everything on the stern as well, which was to be refurbished right there and mated to her new forebody.

As of tonight the Algoma emblem is off the stacks and the name is painted out. TC site shows the registration as closed. If she is being rebuilt as a self-unloader it is not likely it is for Algoma or they would not have closed the registration.